Perhaps we might try this again

[tor lives]

Having just read a comment by one of our usual A/CAM contributors, I have had pause to stop and think.
He mentioned another popular model site that he enjoyed, because one of the things they offered was "Group Builds" ......fair call.
As most regular A/CAMers would recall.....we did attempt the Group Build thing here on A/CAM, but it fell in a heap through complete lack of interest in the end.
I guess the question I would be asking the A/CAM membership now is.....should we give the Group Build thing another crack???
I would be very happy to consider this again if the majority of the contributing A/CAM membership wanted to re-explore this as a Site activity.
The thing is though....if we commit to a Group Build again, we have all got to be fair dinkum about it, and actually follow through.
If a Group Build is what is needed to generate and stir some Site activity and interest, then I am willing to re-examine the prospect.
Over to you guys for a bit of discussion on this.
TOR

[VH-WAL]

Hiya Tor,
me personally.. I just build what I am in the mood to build and I will only participate in a group build if that was what was already on my bench, which is up to now... never! The only sort of group build I have ever participated in is the Hyperscale Airfix and other old manufacturers interest group.. because I just happened to build one or two that qualify. I visit this site several times a day I dont post much because I dont build much these days.. I cant be arsed doing work in progresses anymore especially as I dont seem to build anything worthy enough to go to the effort! I just post finished stuff and aviation photos these days, I do visit every day

[Ansett A330]

Oops! Seeing it looks like I caused this I suppose I should say something.

First of all I didn't mean to offend or for what I wrote (added in Brackets might be more accurate) to come off as a smartarse remark. Apologies if it has offended or if it came off as the latter.

Now to the issue. Britmodeller is totally different to A/CAM. What works over there won't necessarily work over here. For instance their Membership is waay bigger and the topics cover just about everything in Modelling even if it (and the Group Builds) is (are) a bit aviation centric.

But ... and here's the difference the way they handle GBs is I think totally unique in Modelling Forums (Ray S should be able to correct anything that I write that is not accurate as He has waay more experience over there than I have). First of all the Genesis of a GB is proposed by a Member or Members who then basically take Ownership of the GB (with the blessing of Lord Enzo Matrix of course) by gathering up interested Members to reach the "magic number" (30 I think it is?) to then go into the "Bunfight" to gather enough Votes to actually make the GB Program in the next year. If the GB gets a Guernsey (Jersey?) for the next Year then the Person or Persons who proposed it now as the Mod and Assistant Mods generally drive it encouraging (even poking and prodding) those who said they would participate into starting, progressing, and then (heaven forbid) completing and uploading their efforts into the Gallery usually to be voted on.

Now a lot of this is obviously due to the size of the Membership but the point I am making from the above is that whatever GB makes the grade (out of the "Bunfight") over there is basically guaranteed of success simply from the hurdles it had to overcome to get on the GB Program. Now obviously there are ones that either don't get started, or only progress so far, and so not all make it to the Gallery but a fair percentage do get to the Gallery within the allotted time (which is usually extended if Lord Matrix deems so).

Will that work here? Probably not. While the Topic (A/CAM) is focussed the number of Members simply aren't here.

However when looking at something like the Airfix 737-200 Challenge Build I reckon that was pretty successful but obviously the timeframe was stretched out for a number of reasons.

So what sort of GB could work over here? Well I'd venture to suggest that one associated with the A/CAM Expo Display (You'll have to forgive me as I can't recall what the A/CAM Expo Display schedule is off hand without having a look) could work in terms of the lead time to the Display and it's measure of success would contribute to the Display.

But ... one thing I forgot to mention above about Britmodeller GBs was the indexing and format compared with what was the GB indexing and format over here. Over there there are a number of sub levels to the indexing before you get down to the individual GBs and the individual builds while over here (as far as I recall but like Murray Walker I could be completely mistaken) they were all just under Group Builds and had to be sub referenced in the Title. By having only one GB a year (whether it is related to the Display or not) then "only" having the builds under "Group Builds" won't be an issue and it can be cleared each year by archiving the previous Year's GB.

Hope this helps and again apologies if anyone took offence.

[RayS]

Rob has got the BritModeller (BM) Group Build (GB) formula right. As he said there are over 10,000 members over there with a few hundred (or more) actively participating in GBs. That is why their calendar is so full and the Bunfight (or vote) happens this time each year to determine the following year's schedule.

It works well over there. ARC used to be a big GB forum as well but GB interest has waned over there. They recently had an F-14 GB that was successful, but the site seems to centre around Teen Series Fighters and modern US hardware so that is why I think it went so well, the first in quite a few years.

The Unofficial Airfix Modeller's Forum (UAMF) is another I frequent, they have another GB methodology. Like BM you need to suggest a topic and take ownership and if it gets up moderate the GB. The thing is with the moderation you can have more than one, BM GBs usually have 2 mods to help run them. Anyway UAMF have a smaller GB participation rate and you may only get a few interested, I think 6 is the minimum required for a GB to start. Someone suggests a topic, enough interest is garnered, the GB overlord agrees it has enough support and then the group decide on a start date. UAMF GBs are usually short, 4-6 weeks while BM GBs with go for 2-3 months. I think there is a bit of work for the GB Overlord in those forums, moderating and monitoring the chat about future GBs, approving them, creating new forum sub sections for each GB and then allocating permissions to the moderators to be able to edit and remove GB posts as required. I have moderated a couple of GBs over at BM and it is not too onerous, just need to keep peoples build rate and enthusiasm going by commenting of their threads and motivating to get back to it if a thread is not updated in a while. Here is a link to a BM [img=https://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/forum/616-boeing-737-stgb/]B737 GB[/img] I moderated back in 2018, we had 35 builds started and 21 completed.

As Rob also says those other forum sites cover all modelling subjects, we are a little shoe horned here but I think if we do allow the subject matter in GB to diverse I think it may work. I am not sure what others here have interests in to suggest other topics, cars, ships, spacecraft???... military aircraft of course!

With the possible demise of AMI perhaps we could coax some of those folk over here, expand the forum a little to allow for subject creep and would have more folk for GBs as well. I am sure this has been in others mind's as well.

So I am in favour, I suggest the UAMF model be used and tweaked as required. Both Forums mentioned have the GB sub forums and chat area where there GBs are suggested and support gained. I think initially this should be advertised/mentioned in the general chat forum or perhaps,

Here is a link to the UAFM GB Guidelines, they are quite extensive and set out well.

BritModeller's GB guidelines are not as concise but here is a link to their GB FAQs section

[hrtpaul]

I've only ever completed 1 GB and that was the Tigermoth GB over at Britmodeller. I haven't entered many as I'm slow AF, disorganised and can't seem to get much time to model these days. I am interested in many but I don't enter due to the previous reasons. I do get a lot of inspiration from reading GB's and find them quite educational. For the 737-200 GB I had 3-4 planned but only 2 got started and there they have remained. In saying that there were some great entries that really helped my own builds. ATM I'm trying at the moment to finish a few WIP's (including the 737's) so there's not as many models on the go. I certainly wouldn't enter a GB that was over 2-3 months let alone over 4-6 weeks, purely on the time factor. I reckon it'd be a dick move and not very fair to say I'd participate and then not even get close to finishing. I can see Ray S and Rob's points about BM being so much bigger and therefore making GB's a bit easier to run. I try to build at least one model for the ACAM table at expo so maybe that could be a good place to start for a GB here on ACAM. It gives peeps heaps of time to get something done in the time alloted. Anyways that's my 2c worth and I really should get onto my expo build for next year

[BradG]

Do it, I'll build something.

[Ansett A330]

I'm learning my Lesson about GBs. I started a Discussion thread for one on BM four days ago and already ten people have signed up. If it gets through the "Bunfight" I may have something to do in 2023!

[Ansett A330]

Just had an evil thought - if there had been an Airbus A318, 319, 320, 321 GB someone here (not mentioning any Names) would have made it a huge success single handed!

[oz rb fan]

i am guilty of entering a group build and not completing it.....(DAMN 737 decals) and while i may not enter many(only 2 so far)i have enjoyed the experience..but it's not the be all and end all of this site.

[tor lives]

Oops! Seeing it looks like I caused this I suppose I should say something.

First of all I didn't mean to offend or for what I wrote (added in Brackets might be more accurate) to come off as a smartarse remark. Apologies if it has offended or if it came off as the latter.

apologies if anyone took offence.

No offence taken. It was a constructive comment worthy of A/CAM membership group discussion.
TOR