How do Hornets cope in a crosswind?

[Tony P]

From WOI.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JYUm5Nl6318
How do we embed videos from youtube?

[Adam the Akrodude]

No.2 did a much better job. X-wind landings is of course much more a challenge. During my Pitts endorsement, instructor and I purposely went out in a bad day with lots of cross wind (it was gusting over 30 knots) to practice. Why? Because it's not much good having a endorsement on something like a Pitts and not being able to land it in lots of cross-wind. Fuel is always critical when doing a cross-country in small aerobatic aeroplanes and often there just isn't any significant reserve to go to a alternate field if you find out upon arrival at your destination that there's too much cross-wind for you to handle.

I remember asking a F-15 pilot at Avalon how they handle high cross-wind landings. He said it's no big issue. They just land nose pointing into the wind, keeping the wings level and the gear just takes it. Of course nose is pointed in right direction down the runway as soon as the mains hit. Stu and Salty - is it much like this for your big birds - keeping the winds level and nose into wind, then kicking the nose straight either just prior to touchdown, or as soon as the mains hit? I guess your greatest fear is a engine strike/scrape huh?

[Tony P]

The B-52 designers got it right!

[Adam the Akrodude]

I'm sure some of these 'liner drivers would have wished for that BUFF feature in this video! A couple of times my right leg shot out under the desk and kicked over a speaker! Hey Stu and Salty - technical question, what are the most watched Youtube vid's by you guys - airliner crosswind landings?

These drivers sure are earning their money in this video! Imagine being a pax down at the rear.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=la-hSjKP2TU

[Nillus]

All heavy jets I have flown are landed the same way with the exception of the A380.
That is, you allow for the drift by crabbing into the wind (set a heading to allow for the drift so that you track runway centreline).
The judgement displayed during/after the flare technique will determine the smoothness (or otherwise) of the touchdown.

Just prior to tocuching the runway, the drift is 'kicked' off with the rudder and opposite aileron is used to keep wings level (prevention of into- wind wing rising as a result of the secondary effect of rudder). The danger is that if you mis-judge the kick and take the drift off too early, the crosswind will take you off the runway hard surface as you float down the runway...bad for a heavy. Too late and you land with the drift on...when it touches, the aircraft will go in mixture of 2 directions...one, where the tyres are pointed, the other where the velocity vector of the aircraft is pointed. The side stresses are enormous on rubber tyres and metal wheel axles/braces/struts. Ground handling after such an event is 'character building'

You are quite correct in what you say, Adam. The biggest fear in the 747(all types) was a pod strike on engine 1/4.

On the SuperPigBus, whe do a similar thing, but the wings keep themselves level. No need for any aileron input. Quite amazing to watch as the control laws do their magic.

YouTube videos? I mostly look at what is posted on modelling sites. I'm scared to ask what Stu looks at.

[Tony P]

Smooth as silk:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i7Defza_YDM

No so smooth:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nQW6ThGILq4

[Tony P]

YouTube videos? I mostly look at what is posted on modelling sites. I'm scared to ask what Stu looks at.

You are right to be scared Salty.

[Capt NG]

Bahahahahahahaha... Saltys technique not limited to wide bodies, it's a technique we use on the 737 as well. Timing is everything, if you kick the aircraft straight too soon it will drift, too late and you'll have same issues as salty speaks of, on the 737 flap 40, the outboard trailing edge of the flap can get pretty close to the ground if you put too much wing down.

We still rely on that good old pilot skill to judge and get it down.. We don't have the luxury of computers doing work for us.. The only flight control laws we have are...1) nice control, 2) ham fisted control.

There's some good Boeing flight test videos on youtube..here's one.

http://youtu.be/_z2LtHrn9Jw

[Adam the Akrodude]

Bahahahahahahaha... Saltys technique not limited to wide bodies, it's a technique we use on the 737 as well. Timing is everything, if you kick the aircraft straight too soon it will drift, too late and you'll have same issues as salty speaks of, on the 737 flap 40, the outboard trailing edge of the flap can get pretty close to the ground if you put too much wing down.

We still rely on that good old pilot skill to judge and get it down.. We don't have the luxury of computers doing work for us.. The only flight control laws we have are...1) nice control, 2) ham fisted control.

There's some good Boeing flight test videos on youtube..here's one.

http://youtu.be/_z2LtHrn9Jw

Dat's some good gear on the 777! Interesting that it's hit with the mains first, then kick in rudder/op aileron to straighten up.

[Cap'n Wannabe]

Sounds the same kind of technique we teach in the Jabs....allow for drift on final, kick 'er straight with rudder, and use aileron to touch the into-wind wheel down first.
We also have a kind of informal competition to see who can track along the runway on one wheel for the furthest distance....judicial use of power helps here.
As a matter of interest, Salty & Stu, what are the x-wind limits on your respective aircraft? It's interesting to note that while the Jabiru has a published limit of 14kt, there is a note to the effect that it isn't a structural limit like Vne, and can vary according to pilot skill and experience. 20kt is hard work, but doable..