I know it's wrong but....

[tor lives]

I know it's wrong but, god help me, I LOVE this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LU6DoQOd6z0
and this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xfTdRF66QPo
The greenies would scream blue murder, but I just love a sky full of Boeing "overcast"

TOR

[oz rb fan]

how does the C135 even see where he is going?

[RHB785]

BLUE BLOODY MURDER!!!!!!

Regards,
RHB.

[tor lives]

BLUE BLOODY MURDER!!!!!!

Regards,
RHB.

Seems Ross, that you and I are diametrically opposed on this one
To me, seeing those big, bad-arse, beautiful Boeings barrelling out, billowing columns of black smoke behind them is a thing of aero-beauty
What an AWESOME demonstration of aviation power and might!!!!
TOR

[hrtpaul]

Used to love watching the B-52D's and KC-135A's takeoff outta Darwin with a shitload of smoke. The later G models weren't quite as bad but you could still make them out 30min after takeoff. Now this isn't as dirty but it's the sexiest bomber ever and it's J79 powered
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQzwfKwVoZU

[Adam the Akrodude]

Seriously kick ass! Those SAC scrambles sure must have gotten the hearts racing!

Not being a aficionado on BUFF's, one of those vid's shows a start up with some black smoke pouring out from underneath both inner engines. I'm guessing they used starter cartridges on these inner engines so electric starter carts not required?

[RHB785]

No Ray, not really. I was just being a smart alec that's all. Some pollution is necessary and some isn't. Like the story going on at the moment about Williamtown. About the chemicals in the fire fighting foam they used there for years and which the EPA knew about but didn't tell anyone in the local community. That kind of pollution isn't necessary, or at least the non-disclosure isn't and was probably illegal. I must admit I am a bit of a greenie but not to the extent that I can't appreciate and be impressed by those big smokey ol' jets. I think every little bit of pollution that can be saved is saving the planet for the next generations but in those days we didn't kow what we do now. However, back in the day we didn't know as much about a lot of chemicals as we do today. One of the solvents we used to use, Turcosolve has now been banned at least in Australia. That stuff was naaaassstttyyy. But we exposed ourselves to it every day because the job demanded that we did.

I have to admit I also am impressed by those smokey big jets of yesteryear with their water injection jet plumes billowing out in the sky behind them. Of course now that kind of pollution isn't acceptable anymore and the more modern turbofans in the BUFFs today aren't as bad. Nor are the CF-6s in today's KC-135s and nor are they as darned noisey as the JT-8s in our old 707s.

Adam, I'm not sure if those early BUFFs had APUs or not. If not then to make the aircraft more autonomous they may have had cartridge start on the 2 inner engines and then used bleed air from those 2 engines to start the others. Even our 707s when we originally purchased them didn't have APUs and depended on external air carts for starting. The Rays could tell us if all the fleet eventually got APUs or not but I do know that 2 aircraft at least did during my time at Richmond. This made them able to operate independantly anywhere in the world which is the whole idea behind an APU. Even piston engined long range aircraft like the B-29 and later derivatives and Martin Mariner and some Catalinas had small Briggs and Stratton or Tecumseh engines to drive a generator for starting or to provide power for servicing.

Regrds,
RHB.

[Adam the Akrodude]

It kind of looks like a cartridge start on the inner two engines of the BUFF - anyone know? I do remember reading that the B-1 has a push button down near the front nose wheel that starts the engines - pretty cool huh! I guess from battery power, this starts the APU, which then starts the engines in sequence. Pilots then just run up the ladder, push the go levers forward and fly off to war (hopefully not!).

Didn't know that the water injection caused all that black soot - all makes sense now, I learned something! The lower internal combustion temps cause incomplete combustion - hence soot. The gain in mass/density of the air going through increases thrust, even with the reduction in complete combustion. It must have been a nightmare hanging out the laundry on a day when lots of SAC BUFFs and tankers launch!